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tv   The Beat With Ari Melber  MSNBC  September 14, 2017 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT

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a lot of folks in jersey think that would be the case for phil murphy. "the beat" starts now. never a dull moment in new jersey politics. >> the best three years of my life were spent covering it. >> tonight we begin with a story breaking late today. pulling back the curtain for the first time on exactly how donald trump learned bob mueller was taking over the russia investigation. this story is not important because of palace intrigue that is embarrassing to trump and jeff sessions, though it includes much of that. it is an investigative account of how panic over the russia inquiry goes to the top of the white house with implications for the ongoing inquiry into whether trump abused his power the obstruct justice. that's one of the criminal inquiries in mueller's investigation. this was a fantastic and fascinating story to read when it sgim our newsroom.
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three critical revelations, first when they told donald trump that they were appointing bob mueller, donald trump lost it completely. he was in the oval office with mike pence and other aides about hiring a replacement for jim comey. the vacancy that set the special counsel appointment in motion. the times said he launched in a volley of insults, saying his appointment was one of the worst dirgss trump ever made. also calling him a quote, idiot and saying he should resign. we know in public trump says many things about russia. but this is fascinating and important potentially because it is in private. the "times" account saying trump saw this as basically the worst thing that his presidency and erupted in rare self-criticism about his decision to hire sessions. remember, trump could have asked jeff sessions about potential
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recusal before hiring. trump didn't do that simple thing because he wasn't prepared for the job interview and he shows little interest in staffing the federal government. this shows the response was to oust the attorney general so he could get a new one that would not be recused and thus give trump more direct oversight over the russia inquiry. that may be a bad thing for him, at least if investigators believe this "times" account. here's the second revelation. bits sessions who later told people, the attack was the most humiliating experience in decades of public life. sources saying during the meeting he was ashen and emotional. remember, the u.s. senate rejected jeff sessions judicial nomination over his civil rights record and 47 of his former senate colleagues voted against his nomination to this post to be attorney general. when jeff sessions says this was the most humiliating thing in his career, it must have been severe. and we know he offered to
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resign. that has been previously reported in politico. in the new account we learn trump later reversing himself, specific will you rejecting a resignation where a hand written response on it that he sent to sessions. and now finally in our account, the third revelation that is the most legally important. donald trump began taking action to fire the attorney general over the russia investigation. he did it with witnesses in the room and he did it after admitting, have been, that he fired fbi director over the russia investigation. and in this "times" account we learn tonight the only reason president trump didn't go through with this second law enforcement russia-related firing was that pence, bannon and priebus intervened to save mr. sessions' job saying that ousting him would rally republicans against the president. notice that two of the people there in this account who saved sessions no longer work in this
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white house. and note that their stated rationale holding the gop base may be the very reason they offered donald trump, because they know him and they knew that political congratulations might move him. but i think they knew another reason. president trump is under investigation for firing the nation's top investigator over russia. the fbi director. and he tried to oust the nation's top law enforcement officer over russia, the attorney general. priebus and mcgann are facing demands to testify under oath before mueller. this new story suggests bannon will be next. he was part of this decision. part of the reversal and as he man who recently said firing comey was the worst decision in modern political history. maybe steve bannon knew as this report suggests that the russia firing of jim comey was just the tip of the iceberg. i begin now, you spent nine
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years asser prosecutor and counsel to new york city mayor bill de blasio. you look at this account. what do you think of those aides intervening to prevent the firing of jeff sessions? >> are the real question raised by that, what reasons did they give the president for keeping jeff sessions around? i mean, the "times" mention that had there was a political congratulations. but what exactly did they say? what other reasons did they give? what dreens the president reject? what was he saying in response to them? every word he says and every word they say to him is going to be dissected by mueller and his team. because it would be evidence of the president's the intend and state of mind. and none of their conversations with him are privileged. so all of that will come in and all that will be examined. >> you're saying what was likely not privileged is anything that
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they or the are don mcgann would say. you've been a counsel to a chief executive in government. the type of things that don mcgann may haved will donald trump, for example, if you do this on top of comey, it could contribute to an obstruction case. that's something that mueller can probably get out of him, do you think? >> it he could. and we certainly know he'll try. one of the things he can get, is any hand written notes. this is not just about what someone will say in an interview but what kind of documents exist and we often think about formal written records and we forget that in addition to e-mails, there are also the notes that people will take in a discussion and lawyers in particular, as you and i both know, will take notes in order to better understand the facts and give legal advice. so i think there's a lot there that mueller will be able to dig into. >> and the handwritten note that donald trump according to the types wrote to jeff sessions?
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does that go into what the special counsel can get? >> for sure. now, i think i would have to think that note would be very carefully thought out by the president and his staff. because obviously there was a lot of discussion before that. but certainly mueller can get and it it is, if the contents of the note were not revealed in the story. you have to wonder why somebody leaked the rest of the account but not that. and one thing to follow up on what you were taurk on maya about, the d.c. circuit court of peas, the federal court of appeals had to examine this in the past when kenneth starr was trying to get the conversations between bruce lindsey, then the white house counsel and president clinton and decided there was no attorney general-client privilege. even to don mcgann's comments to president trump. >> we have two experienced government attorneys. stay with me. i want to bring in john stanton,
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an expert he who worked jeff sessions on the armed services committee. john, on the context, this week we're talking a lot about the flynn family who are both the father and son, now subjects in the mueller inquiry around the same time this was happening. around may 16th. the day before this explosion, as reported in the "new york times" tonight. was when comey's memo leaked saying there was a request for him to end the flynn investigation. it suggested behind the scenes this week, donald trump was spending a lot of time worried about trying contain russia. >> yeah. i think if you remember back then, the russia investigation was what everyone was talking about. and he was very clearly kind of obsessed with it. and it is not surprising that memo he would come out that he would then explode at jeff
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sessions. i think it was very clear from his behavior and how he was talking about things that he was feel very trapped almost and being hunted by people to. a certain degree, it is a little bit understandable that this would be a problem for him. although it sort of goes to what i think you mentioned earlier. he doesn't seem to have been well prepared for dealing with these issues. staffing people, figuring out how you would go about firing somebody in a manner where it didn't cause problems for you. all these things. like he is doing it by the seat of his pants. >> it is so striking. evelyn, i served in the federal government, a very low level, you served at a very high level. i think we both know there are job and interview memos that are are meticulously prepared when you are looking at job positions. we know donald trump isn't doing that. walk us through your view of the story of that piece, and jeff
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sessions, who according to the associate who's spoke with the "times" who. this was the most embarrassing incident of his career. >> look, donald trump brought this upon himself. he was the one conducting all kinds of meetings and letting his staff conduct all kinds of meetings with the russians who didn't come clean. he and his staff refused to acknowledge discussions or what kind of relations they had with kremlin officials or i would call them informal officials. the oligarchs, people close to the kremlin. so they had this whole obfuscation strategy which was the wrong strategy and the firing of comey we may find out was truly legally an obstruction of justice issue. then you get to how he treated secretary sessions, which in my opinion, was pretty abysmal. first of all, either it shows that he lacked understanding about the legal jeopardy. what was at stake for secretary
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sessions. or if he did, it showed a callousness. i think the other quote we might bear in mind when we talk about secretary sessions' response, the response he had in july. if you remember, he said on the record, it's hurtful. and i think that's the thing that makes me feel a little bit badly about this. the one thing about secretary sessions, whether you agree with him politically or not. while i was there, i worked on the other side of the aisle. i didn't agree with him on policy issues, although some were very bipartisan because it was armed services. but else always polite, always gentleman. he always tried to be the southern gentleman. he took pride in being a christian. ted boy scout motto on his desk. >> i don't care how polite he was. i care that he made what he thought was the right independent decision at the doj in consult wags the ethics lawyers. whatever everyone thinks about his attitudes, he listened to
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the ethics lawyers. he said you're too close. and that trump wanted to oust him for that is a problem. >> he dperd proper judgment in that situation. i only add the personal stuff because it gets on donald trump's character. >> the difference between sessions and trump is sessions serve in the government and he knew what he had to do and he did it. upon becoming president, trump thought all his worries in life were over. he wasn't just president. he was like king. he didn't have to abide by rules. he didn't have to be careful. he didn't have to consult with other people. he could act impulsively. which everything he did with sessions was impulsive. everything he did with comey was impulsive. looking back on it, bannon is
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right. firing comey will turn out likely to be one of the biggest political mistakes mr. recent history. because there's been a cascading number of events since then, including mueller. trump is not good at controlling his anger. sessions is personally decent and it mufbl the most humiliating thing. it was done many front of other people. and trump has not shown any loyalty to one of the most loyal people to him ever. >> the first endorser. >> and john, this same report, from the "times," said trump in july told associates he wanted to remove sessions but for a second time didn't take action. something mueller will look at. both things they did and things that they attempted. >> that's right.
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they said we didn't actually do something. they did try. and the fact he was considering this is definitely something that mueller will look at. and i do think that he considered doing it. they backed off and kept him from doing it until his attention was focused elsewhere. again, it does point to the fact there's not a lot of planning going on. they're just dealing with things as he decides to dewith them on the spur of the moment. not a great way to run a railroad that has giant nuclear weapons. >> and here was donald trump on that fateful day on an aircraft carrier making it even harder. because when the president says, the attorney general should not recuse, it is exactly the kind of evidence of interference that makes for the recusal case. take a look at this moment in history. >> mr. president, do you still have confidence in the attorney general? >> total. >> mr. president, should sessions recuse himself in the
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investigation into your campaign and russia? >> i don't think so. >> margaret, i don't think he e-vinced in that moment any awareness of what he was doing is that why it made it worse. no. a recusal would not be something that trump would be familiar with. once he became familiar with it, he still didn't understand why it was the right thing to do and why sessions had to do it. so he blamed sessions personally. the human resacks to feel sorry for sessions. the legal reaction is to say it is one more incident that mueller has to show intent, to interfere with the investigat n investigation. if you get, it doesn't matter if you get fruits of what you set out to do. it just matters that you tried to do it. >> as a legal matter, that we're
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bad at collusion and obstructing justice isn't the best defense. i'm going to check back with you later on the show. thank you all. coming up, the right wing having a lot of concern over trump's deal or was it no deal with democrats. others stunned by trump repeating the claim. this is brand new. both sides to blame for charlottesville violence. a violence. >> he likes us. he likes me anyway. >> border wall turning into a sham. you may be skeptical but we have new reporting from the trump administration that they may not like. this is a story about mail and packages.
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one way to read the big political story is donald trump made a deal on amnesty for d.r.e.a. d.r.e.a.m.ers. the most charitable reading to democrats announcing the outline of an immigration deal and the truly bizarre parsing to d.r.e.a. d.r.e.a.m.ers. >> we're looking at people to stay here. >> not citizenship but stay here. >> here's how the prosecutor before he was fired described it. trump will not be discussing autocracy but will discuss legal undermining of democratic norms over a period of time. in other words, this is amnesty by another name. that's what's in the deal. is there even a deal?
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before trump walked back this possible agreement with his tweet storm, some reporters we skeptical that any hand shakes deal with democrats on immigration would hold. >> the phrasing is we came to an agreement? >> yes. an agreement. we agreed to enshrine the protections of daca into law quickly. >> i am disinclined to believe anything that donald trump says about his own future behavior or that anybody else says that donald trump has committed to anything about his own future behavior until i actually see the behavior. >> that was prophetic proven by this morning. then there's all the politics. whatever trump was saying or committing to, conservative groups already up in arms. maybe breitbart hears what it wants to hear about the nickname of nicknames, amnesty don. steve king is upset.
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>> i think something is going to have to get reversed here with this president's policy or it will just blow up in his base. this was a straight up promise all the way through campaign. what it means is the base will leaving him. they won't be able to defend him anymore. >> bill kristol, there it is. from deal to no deal. conservatives saying any deal like this is a deal breaker. what do you make of it? i've been reading people today and i think the trump supporters are sticking with trump of they like trump more than they dislike immigrants of for better or worse. they're in love with trump. he can sell this to a surprising number of supporters or they won't fundamentally break with him. whether there's actual legislation. people can say they have a deal. that's a long way from actually drafting legislation, getting 218 votes in the house. 51 votes or 60 votes in the
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senate. so i don't think just because three leaders meet, there's a deal. i want to add one word just because of the interesting panel you had. i'm just very struck. i don't think we generally fully appreciated what steve bannon said. he was in a lot of these meetings, the one we discussed. he's a smart guy. when he said it is the biggest mistake ever to fire comey, maybe he's being rhetorical. that will look silly a year from now if mueller finds nothing impeachable. if he indicts a couple people. there are whatever tries and the thing goes nowhere. then it won't turn out to have been a big deal whether comey was doing the investigating or mueller was. butter i think bannon must think this this, that mueller will threaten trump presidency. and bannon is in a position to know what might be there. at least the suspect what might be there. the only second point, the
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russian meeting, to me the key thing is that july 8 moment afrlt with discussed it, on air force one where trump dictates a clearly false account of what happened in that meeting. why do that? you're asking for trouble. why do that? talk about setting yourself for obstruction charges. that's an easy one. that's not like trying to fire jeff sessions. he is entitled to fire him. but actually misleading beam the actual subject at hand, russia? why does dough that unless he's very worried about what will come out? >> so you think when people heard steve bannon saying this was the worst decision ever, firing comey, that was a backward looking assessment. you think it is forward looking because it shows banner's view of where they're head. >> he is holding most of the support. he's not in disastrous shape. it is not empirically true that the trump presidency has paid a
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huge price so far for replacing the comey investigation with the mueller investigation. >> that's fascinating. back to the immigration point for a second. this is the moment chat we again to see if trumpism is a personality cult or if it has a high policy content. if the trump supporters stick when i am, while people like then are saying betrayal, betrayal, this is a movement centered on a man even more than his ideas. i do think the deal we're talking about, if it is a deal, is in some ways a graceful exit for the president. he can't get wall built. so he defers that. he is going to move the immigration debate off. it is most unfavorable for the d.r.e.a.m.ers. most of the country wants them to stay. it is an bad deal for him given the reality of the politics right now. it is not a great deal in terms of campaign promises. >> with, you raise that and it goes to the so-called cult
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personality. if that's true, and we'll talk about this later in the show with chuck schumer's hot mike moment, if that's true, then donald trump can do a lot more. because people are bound to him for reasons other than policy. then you look at the republicans. i don't know how much bob marley you listen to. he said you can run and run and run away but you can't run away from yourself. you have a lot of republicans running away from their own record on immigration issues. take a look at this. >> call the press off. >> are you going through with the president negotiating with democrats? >> i've got to catch an airplane. sorry about that. >> do you support a bill that doesn't have the wall being built? >> i support enforcement. >> that's not exactly an answer
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of the. >> i've got to go. >> bill? >> look, the deal that is some combination of, if it's daca, legalization but not necessarily a path to citizenship. combined with heightened enforcement and not quite a wall. they can add that to a continuing resolution, debt ceiling, tax deal, infrastructure deal. he would lose some republican votes but he would get a lot of democratic votes if schumer and pelosi are on board. so could you end one this classic half democrat, half republican deal with the conservative republicans opposing it and i suppose some of the left wing of the democratic party might oppose it. if you would have told me a month ago after charlottesville when correctly, i think, people were saying how can you associate with donald trump? people were asking every advisory council to quit. if you had that a month matter chuck schumer and nancy pelosi would be palling around with
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donald trump over dinner at the white house, they're politicians. they think they're getting a good dinner for the policies they care about. it is kind of head spinning. is the guy such a monster that you can't deal with him? or you can have dinner with him and then go ahead for the next two or three months with an actual legislative agenda when you'll be working him. >> the question for shoop willer and pelosi, what are you getting? we showed the clip, my could evening saying if this is based on a prediction of a deal of future behavior, you have to get the behavior, the policy. if not, then you really get the short end of the stick. breaking news. north korea has launched a missi missile. we can tell you are it was fired over the northern island of hokkaido. i'm lucky to get through a shift without a disaster.
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donald trump is an idealog. donald trump doesn't care about passing legislation or donald trump cares about making deals. those are just some of the could not views out there that "the new york times" has published all of those claims. they can't all be true. or can they? trump contradicts himself because he is not a set of ideas seeking a platform. he is a platform seeking ideas. that helps explain his approach to the d.r.e.a.m.ers. he says he'll deport them many six months. until then, ework democrats to get them permanent protection from deportation. now, that's protection from deport participation trump himself is threatening. it is hard to win an argument with yourself. one mind who knows trump's mind better than most is the news max ceo. his new article says trump is turbulent, controversial and
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polarizing and that trump is facing a turning point. he entered swept no major wins and a record low of 34% which explains the thirst to make disease. so trump's swiveling on daca. returning the resignation letter to mr. swegss a hand written response on it to not resign. that may be the one time jeff sessions was in the same spot. no matter how close you listen to trump, you can't tell if he wants you to stay or go. with me now is president trum s confidante. good evening to you both. what do you make of donald trump doing these negotiations which in some sense are with himself. since he has the power on himself. >> you used the words polarizing and controversial.
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i used that to describe his first eight months in office. what i say in my blog today on news max, the real donald trump we saw last night. a unifier, he reaches out, he compromises, he wants to bring people together. i think we're seeing that. i think the election, a very bitter campaign, a very difficult time. people on your network have been calling for hip to be impeached almost from the day he took office. >> like who? >> oh, maxine waters. >> we interview people from both parties. >> and a lot of people. >> who else? >> i'll give you a list. i'll send over a list. >> we're doing a live interview. you make a statement like that. and could it mislead someone sboothing you're referring to the network. >> a lot of people have been using your network to say everything about impeachment, to say he's mentally insane. you just turn on morning joe, joe scarborough, who i like a
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lot. but he's gone off the rail sometimes. he said he thought president he had dementia, pre alzheimer's, look at the transcripts. and i don't think that really shows -- the president is the type of guy that approaches things differently than politicians. i think it is one of the reasons he got elected. and i really applaud, let's applaud that he is making a bipartisan approach. and he is rethinking a lot of his positions. i think this is' really positive thing. instead of looking to the past, i think we should be looking to actively here. >> i appreciate that. you made the assertion about impeachment. i don't think folks this network have advocated that. your response of the. >> i think that's true. i lived through impeachment once and very few democrats, unlike republicans, are calling for impeachment until more facts are
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on the table. i think there's something to what chris is saying in that trump is trying to turn the corner and reach out. i think donald trump got rolled. the democrats getting everything they want. they're likory to get daca enshrined into law although trump has said that would never happen in his campaign. and they're delinking it from the border campaign. the staff and members of congress are all saying there will not be any linkage between extension of daca or code identify indication. and why there are short term benefits to getting a deal done with democrats. it should help him in the polls. should help across party lines. i think there's a larger question about whether that would be a victory for this president. this president is under criminal investigation. two-thirds of the party don't trust him. let me finish one point.
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and he continues to alienate establishment republicans in the senate. and if he starts on now alienate the base with breitbart, you had the previous segment calling him amnesty don. >> i think this is a huge win for the president. he is saying he is alienating the gop establishment. let's look at the facts. they did not want a border wall. >> the base of the. >> i think if you look at the polling, 70% of publics, according to the latest politico poll support keeping the d.r.e.a.m.ers here. so the president has broad support. he knows he can't remove them even if he would write executive action. mcconnell is that ryan want to keep them. he now has the senate democrats on board plus he got they will to fund massively border security. >> that may be -- hold on. that's interesting.
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your view, and you do talk to the president regularly, is that while he set the six-month deadline, you think his goal is not to deport d.r.e.a.m.ers? >> absolutely. >> hold a second. and chris, you think that basically the deal that was discussed and then withdrawn from chuck schumer and nancy pelosi is still on the table. >> absolutely. they're saying there's no formal deal. i think chuck and nancy jumped the gun a little bit. they should have allowed the president to speak with the republicans to make sure they were on board with this. inform they will. they didn't give they will any breathing time. i don't think they were expecting the announcement. the overall picture is really good. a lot of people on msnbc didn't like the president, this is an opportunity to rethink. give him a little time. why don't we applaud him when he does something in a bipartisan fashion. >> julian, i give you the last
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20 seconds. >> chris misses the point. the president campaigned against this. he is saying to his central, to his base supporters, they can't trust him. the same way the president has betrayed his base. there's a long list of betrays with congressional republicans and i think the question the democrats had ask, is this guy a trust worthy partner. and the likelihood is given his record, in the last seven or eight months, switching positions constantly. the lies that have been chronicled repeatedly. i think the answer is that they will continue to play him when they can. opportunistingly but president trump is getting nothing out of this. the fact he is a deal maker agreeing on democratic terms is a joke. he betrayed his base on this. >> his poll newspapers will go up. >> the big question is who is getting played? thank you. the reality on the border wall, especially with the facts and
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south korean defense officials have reported that the north koreans apparently fired another ballistic missile in an easterly direction out over japan. the missile apparently landing in the pacific ocean mirroring an incident about two weeks ago when the north koreans in defiance of the world community fired off a similar ballistic missile around the same sizer a couple weeks ago. this is coming a couple days after the u.n. council passed another round of sanctions. the information that we have so far is that this missile flew over japan. that there were no fragment that's fell on to japanese territory. importantly, this missile was not flown in a southerly direction toward the u.s. territory of guam as the north koreans have threatened to do. and as the united states has said it would retaliate against if that were to happen. we're still trying to get all the details we can but it appears the north koreans have
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fired off another missile. there was no attempt to shoot it down by the japanese or the united states military in the area. we're still trying to understand the details of what happened. the south korean government is about to meet in emergency session to decide how the respond to this. we understand that there were apparently south korean military exercises going on around the same time that the north koreans fired off this test missile. so we don't quite tk sequence of the events but the two things were happening in the same proximity. another dangerous escalation of the conflict. and again, another test, another act of defiance by the north koreans. we're trying to sort what they did, what happened. a missile apparently flying over japan and landing in the pacific ocean. >> ron allen reporting from south korea. thank you. next up, we have as promised, a special report on
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today donald trump is walking back his pledge to build a wall. we have a new report on what's really going on. here was trump today. >> the wall will come later. we're renovating large sections of wall. massive sections, making it brand new. we're doing a lot of renovation. we're know four different samples of the wall to see which one we're going to choose and the wall is going to be built. it will be funded a little later of the. >> trump has gone from saying mexico will fund a new was to saying americans will fund a new was to today fwaikt being funded later and emphasizing renovation instead of a new wall. if you've ever worked with contractors, you know there's a big difference between building a new kitchen and renovating a
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new kitchen. so there is a wall replacement project that is finishing up in new mexico. the customs department conif i were will that to "the beat" today but began under the bush administration with bush amendment with $11 million for fencing. there's another replacement project in arizona as well, that plan began four years ago and was funded during the obama administration. as for trump's reference today to those four samples, federal officials tell us eight, not four prototypes will be built soon and what we learn from those may be employed in future wall projects. that doesn't mean a wall will be built. a prototype is a preliminary model from something other forms are developed or copied. that means there's a moodad l f the wall but no funding. now we could seek foreign aid. >> we will build a great wall and mexico will pay for the wall.
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mexico is going to pay for the wall. they continue know it yet but they're going the pay for the wall. they'll be happy to do it. mexico will pay for the wall. who is going to pay for the wall? 100%. >> 100% or maybe 0%. when we asked where this money would come from to build the prototype, trump officials conceded to the beat today quote, future construction is tied to a budget passing congress. so here's your decoder for trump's new words on the wall. the current renovation is from the obama and bush administrations. >> the wall will come later. we're right now renovating large sections of wall, massive sections, making it brand-new. we're doing a lot of renovation. >> that's the renovation they're doing. now it may sound like trump is working harder to pretend there's construction than actually getting construction done.
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well, that's something she's ac e he's proud of. he boasted about the fact that he took a vacant lot to fill with bulldozers and what the bulldozers did he said wasn't important. so long as they did a lot of it. they can dig up dirt from one side of the site and dump it on the other. now remember, donald trump the businessman didn't just stage that fraudulent construction site. he bragged about it yarveafterw. he thinks he can fool some of the people a lot of the time. that's bad news if you want a wall built. and for trump it's only bad news if people who wanted a wall built ever found out.
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now to a revealing peek inside democrat's strategy for cornering trump caught on a hot mike when senator chuck schumer thought no one could hear him. now resh, schumer's public message has been that he'll talk to trump about dem priorities but also hold the line. >> we're going to hold his feet to the fire, i can assure you of this. anything we're going to support will get almost no republican votes. that may mean we support him on nothing. but we're not going to sacrifice our principles for the sake of compromise. >> that's when we knew the mike was on. here's a fascinating moment on the senate floor we're about to air for the first time when chuck schumer didn't know a hot
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mike picked him up saying trump may like him more than mitch mcconnell. >> he likes us. he likes me any. look, what we said was exactly accurate. >> he likes me anyway. then schumer shows his canny side explaining that he gave trump advice that in politics like basketball you got to be able to dribble in more than one direction. this protip would benefit democrats in trump follows it. >> hereby's what i told him. i saud, mr. president, you're better off if you can step left or right. if you have to step in one direction, you're boxed. he gets that. oh, it's going work out and it'll make us more productive too. >> oh, it's gonna work out. back with me, a former aid to bill de blasio. what chuck schumer are we seeing there. >> the deal maker who understands that he wants to get
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legislation done and he's trying to ensure that he has a president with whom he might be able to work on the issues that they were talking about, daca in particular and he wants a deal. >> does it work though if trump finds out that trump now says this? >> well, i think it can still work because the truth is it's in trump's interest to solve this problem that he has because this is a very popular program. they are the elections coming up in 2018. everybody is looking at the impacts of this. >> here he sounds perfectly collegileeollegial with mcconne >> these are governors. they have to govern the country. this is a conversation about bipartisan when what we need to have a public ability to be bipartisan. >> then donald trump said this today. >> i think especially in light of the advent of ante fa, if you
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look at what's going on there, you know, you have some pretty bad dudes on the other side also. a lot of people have actually written, gee, trump might have a point. i said, you got some very bad people on the other side also, which is true. >> back to both sides. >> well, there's having negotiation and there are facts. sometimes what donald trump says are what i call false facts. it's simply not true that they're all equally bad. in fact the statistics show that domestic terrorism is much more likely to be perpetrated by people on the far right 74% of domestic murders in the past decade have been far right, far left was 2%. >> right. and charlottesville was white supremacists conducting a murder. >> correct. >> his need to go back to this. >> what it demonstrates is what he had demonstrated after charlottesville is that he actually is not going to stand up for both racial tolerance and
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a unified country when it comes to race. >> thank you very much. that's our show. i'll see you back here tormd. "hardball" with chris matthews starts right now. trump dates democrats. let's play hardball. good eve wng, i'm chris matthews in washington. about 24 hours ago donald trump was sitting down to dinner with house democrat leader nancy pelosi and senate democrat leader chuck schumer. chuck and nancy as the president calls them. joined the president and a few members of his cabinet to discuss trade, china and protection for those called drooe drooemz. around 9:30 p.m. the white house put out a statement t


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